The Memory Pioneer

"Today's conversation on A Bit Personal with Jodi feels especially timely. We're living in a moment where technologies we depend on, from AI to the devices in our hands, are all powered by something most of us rarely think about — memory."

「今天这期《A Bit Personal》来得格外应景。我们正身处这样一个时刻:我们赖以为生的技术——从 AI 到手里的设备——背后都被一样我们几乎不会想到的东西所驱动:记忆体(memory)。」

"And right now, memory is not just essential, it's incredibly high demand and short supply. Which makes today's guest someone uniquely important."

「而此刻,记忆体不只是不可或缺,它正处在需求极旺、供给极紧的状态。这让今天的嘉宾显得格外重要。」

"Sanjay Mehrotra is the CEO of Micron Technology, one of the world's leading memory and storage companies, helping to power everything from cloud computing to artificial intelligence. He's spent decades at the center of this space, co-founding SanDisk and playing a pivotal role in shaping the flash memory revolution."

「Sanjay Mehrotra(桑杰·梅赫罗特拉)是美光科技(Micron Technology)的 CEO,这是全球领先的存储与记忆体公司之一,从云计算到人工智能都靠它供能。几十年来他一直站在这个领域的中心,联合创办了 SanDisk,在闪存革命里扮演了关键角色。」

"But beyond the scale of what he leads, what I find compelling is how someone navigates that kind of responsibility, especially at a moment when the world is quite literally relying on the decisions he makes."

「但比起他执掌的规模,真正让我着迷的是:一个人怎么扛起这种责任——尤其是在全世界几乎是字面意义上依赖他所做决策的当口。」

"Because this isn't just a conversation about technology, it's about leadership under pressure, and the people shaping what comes next. So, let's get to it. Sanjay, welcome to A Bit Personal."

「因为这不只是一场关于技术的对话,它讲的是压力之下的领导力,以及正在塑造未来的人。那我们就开始吧。Sanjay,欢迎来到《A Bit Personal》。」

"Yes, great to be here with you."

「很高兴和你坐在一起。」

"Yeah, I'm so... [looking forward] to it. Thank you. I'm very honored to be in your home, this beautiful home, and in your office. There's lots of stories back here. Do you have any favorite books on your bookshelf back here?"

「是啊,我太……期待了。谢谢你。能来到你家、这么漂亮的家,还有你的书房,我深感荣幸。这后面藏着不少故事。你书架上有什么特别喜欢的书吗?」

"Well, actually quite a few, you know, definitely quite a few. And, you know, we love to collect books when we visit places, so many of them are related to that, too."

「其实挺多的,真的挺多。我们去到各地都喜欢收集书,所以很多书都跟我们去过的地方有关。」

"You know, there's a book on Gita, that's like Hindu's holy scriptures. I think that's once in a while, you know, fun to look at some of the pages there, too."

「比如有一本讲《薄伽梵歌》(Gita)的,那相当于印度教的圣典。时不时翻翻里面几页,也挺有意思的。」

"Nice. Nice. Well, I have to say that we were going to do this interview a few weeks ago. And I got trumped by Trump. Okay, so you got invited to be part of the White House delegation to China."

「不错不错。我得说,这次采访我们本来几周前就要做的,结果被特朗普(Trump)给『截胡』了——你被邀请加入了白宫访问中国的代表团。」

"So, tell us a little bit what that was like. What was it like to get the phone call? And then what was it like to take the trip?"

「跟我们讲讲那是种什么体验?接到那通电话是什么感觉?然后这趟出访又是什么感觉?」

"Well, it was definitely quite an honor and privilege to represent Micron. And definitely it was fun. It was exciting and quite an experience."

「能代表美光,绝对是一份荣幸,也是难得的殊荣。而且确实很有意思,既兴奋又是一次很特别的经历。」

"You know, took part in President Trump engaging with the CEOs on that morning that he was welcomed in Washington, D.C. And the CEOs that were there were also actually privileged to see him welcomed by President Xi. That was an exciting ceremony to watch."

「那天上午特朗普总统在华盛顿与几位 CEO 交流,我也在场。在场的几位 CEO 还有幸看到他受到习主席的欢迎,那个仪式看着很令人激动。」

"And we took part in some of the bilateral dialogue. President Trump introduced the CEOs in the bilateral dialogue as well as the banquet at night. So, it was overall great to see U.S. and China coming together and building a relationship toward greater stability — and that will be good for everybody."

「我们也参与了一部分双边对话。特朗普总统在双边对话以及当晚的宴会上介绍了几位 CEO。总体来说,看到美中两国走到一起、朝着更大的稳定去建立关系,我觉得很好——这对所有人都是好事。」

"Talking is good. Even if there's not, you know, hard and fast measures, I think that talking is good. And so, who do you hope comes out of it?"

「对话是好事。哪怕没有什么硬性、确定的成果,我也觉得对话本身就是好的。那么,你希望从中走出来的是什么?」

"Well, as a business leader, definitely always looking for that environment that fosters innovation, provides a platform for innovation benefit to all the businesses. And of course, stability and predictability and certainty around investments, as well."

「作为一个企业领导者,我当然始终在寻找那种能滋养创新的环境——为所有企业提供一个创新受益的平台。当然,还有围绕投资的稳定性、可预测性和确定性。」

"And did you go on Air Force One?"

「那你坐空军一号了吗?」

"No, I did not."

「没有,没坐。」

"Okay, I was going to ask if you took any goodies. [laughter]"

「好吧,我本来还想问你有没有顺点纪念品回来。(笑)」

"So, I've been looking forward to this conversation so much because you and Micron and memory are at the center of our world right now. Certainly, any conversation that happens about AI includes a discussion about capacity, memory, and energy."

「我特别期待这场对话,因为你、美光和记忆体,现在正处在我们这个世界的中心。任何关于 AI 的讨论,几乎都绕不开产能、记忆体和能源。」

"So you're more important than ever. So, tell me how this moment feels for you."

「所以你比以往任何时候都更重要。跟我说说,此刻对你来说是什么感觉?」

"I've been in this industry now for 45-plus years, and this is the most exciting time for our industry. And I truly believe that the best is yet to come."

「我在这个行业已经干了 45 年多,而现在是我们这个行业最激动人心的时刻。我真心相信,最好的还在后头。」

"Memory becoming such a key enabler for AI — because today memory is not just about a component in devices like smartphones or PCs. Today, memory is absolutely enabling intelligence in artificial intelligence. It's helping improve the intelligence."

「记忆体成了 AI 的关键支撑——因为今天,记忆体不再只是手机、PC 这类设备里的一个零件。今天,记忆体实实在在地让人工智能里的『智能』成为可能,它在帮助提升智能本身。」

"So the opportunities for memory are tremendous, and of course, it's a very exciting time. And very proud of Micron's team as really the only US company that is in semiconductor memory manufacturing — proud of the team that has worked hard over the decades, so committed to advancements in memory technology roadmap, product roadmap, to get to this point where memory has become absolutely center of the AI revolution."

「所以记忆体的机会是巨大的,这当然是一个非常激动人心的时刻。我也为美光的团队感到骄傲——它是美国唯一一家做半导体存储制造的公司。这支团队几十年来辛勤付出,如此执着于推进存储的技术路线图、产品路线图,才走到今天这一步:记忆体彻底站到了 AI 革命的中央。」

"You know, I always considered Micron as a national treasure."

「你知道,我一直把美光看作一件国之重器(national treasure)。」

"And I think the world is seeing what a great national treasure Micron is, particularly in the midst of this AI revolution."

「而且我觉得,全世界正在看到美光是多么了不起的一件国之重器,尤其是在这场 AI 革命的当口。」

"Right. Every decision that you're making right now has ripple effects throughout the entire industry, and really even the global economy. So, how do you handle that kind of pressure?"

「是啊。你现在做的每一个决定,都会在整个行业、甚至整个全球经济里激起涟漪。那你是怎么应对这种压力的?」

"I mean, do you have some sort of habit or ritual or mantra that you do on a daily basis that keeps you grounded and sane?"

「我是说,你有没有某种每天都会做的习惯、仪式或口头禅,能让你保持踏实和清醒?」

"You know, I think it's all about the team, and it really has been wonderful to have worked with very many of these team members for a very long time. As I said, Micron national treasure, so very many strong leaders. When I joined Micron, I inherited them as part of my team."

「我觉得说到底是靠团队。能和这么多团队成员长期共事,真的很美好。我说了,美光是国之重器,里面有非常多强悍的领导者。我加入美光时,他们就作为团队的一部分『继承』给了我。」

"But other leaders as well that I've worked with for a very long time in the industry in my prior years at SanDisk. Combining the team together — and that team that I truly consider among the very best in the semiconductor industry — and having all the experience of being in our semiconductor industry for so long, that really is the best asset that I personally have."

「还有一些是我早年在 SanDisk、在这个行业里共事了很久的领导者。把这支队伍拢到一起——我真心认为它是半导体行业里最顶尖的团队之一——再加上在半导体行业摸爬这么久积累的全部经验,这才是我个人手里最好的资产。」

"That helps me manage through all the opportunities and, of course, from time to time, challenges in our industry and in our business."

「它帮我应对所有的机会,当然也包括行业和业务里时不时冒出来的挑战。」

"So, being in your home, I met your beautiful wife a few moments ago. It's very calm here. So that has to be part of it — that when you come from a calm household, maybe you don't feel the pressure quite as much."

「在你家里,我刚才见到了你美丽的太太。这里很安宁。所以这一定也是其中一部分原因吧——当你来自一个安宁的家,也许你感受到的压力就没那么大。」

"Absolutely correct. I think the support that the family provides is critically important. My wife is really a pillar of strength and calmness and composure."

「完全正确。我觉得家庭提供的支持至关重要。我太太真的是力量、平静与从容的支柱。」

"And in memory industry, semiconductor industry, you know, it's gone through lots of ups and downs. So having that support system at home absolutely is a big advantage, big plus, no question about it."

「而存储行业、半导体行业,经历过太多起起落落。所以家里有这样一个支持系统,绝对是一大优势、一大加分项,这一点毫无疑问。」

"Okay, so let's talk a little bit about those cycles. You've been in the industry a long time. You've seen dozens of cycles. It is the nature of the semiconductor industry to be cyclical. So within the semiconductor industry, memory is the most volatile — and no pun intended. I bet you've heard that before."

「好,我们来聊聊周期。你在这行待了很久,见过几十轮周期。半导体行业天生就是周期性的。而在半导体行业里,存储是波动最大的——这话不是双关,我猜你以前肯定听过。」(译注:volatile 既指『波动剧烈』,也指存储里的『易失性内存』,故称『不是双关』。)

"But today it's — I mean it's always either feast or famine for you guys, and today it's feast. Congratulations on joining the trillion-dollar club. You have tons of cash on hand. Your stock price, the valuation of the company, has doubled in 48 days. It's pretty incredible to watch this ride."

「但今天——你们这行向来不是丰年就是荒年,而今天是丰年。恭喜你们加入万亿美元俱乐部。你们手握大把现金,股价、公司估值在 48 天里翻了一倍。看着这趟过山车,实在让人惊叹。」

"Is this just another cycle at a different scale, or does AI have the ability to change the nature of our industry?"

「这只是又一轮周期、只不过规模不同?还是说,AI 有能力改变我们这个行业的本质?」

"Absolutely. Without semiconductors there's no AI, and memory is very much the backbone, a key enabler. As I mentioned earlier, as models get larger, as inference continues to grow — you go from training to inference, you go from data center to edge — you just need more and more memory. More memory, more capacity, higher performance, lower power."

「绝对会。没有半导体就没有 AI,而记忆体很大程度上就是它的脊梁、是关键支撑。我前面说过,随着模型越来越大、推理(inference)不断增长——从训练走向推理,从数据中心走向边缘——你需要的记忆体只会越来越多。更多记忆体、更大容量、更高性能、更低功耗。」

"These are all essential to realize the improvements in intelligence from one generation to the next, from one model to the next, from one inference application to the next. And now agentic AI — with agentic AI, orchestration of AI, this has led to tremendous increase in demand for memory, whether it is in a GPU platform or a TPU platform or it's an ASIC. You need more and more memory."

「要实现一代代、一个模型到下一个模型、一个推理应用到下一个推理应用的智能跃升,这些都是必需的。现在又有了 agentic AI(智能体 AI)——agentic AI、对 AI 的编排调度,带来了记忆体需求的巨大增长,不管是在 GPU 平台、TPU 平台,还是 ASIC 上,你都需要越来越多的记忆体。」

"So you have to look at the demand side: memory is a key enabler of intelligence in artificial intelligence. Intelligence is all about data. Data is all about memory. And when you look at token economics, that definitely relies on memory."

「所以你得看需求侧:记忆体是人工智能里『智能』的关键支撑。智能的核心是数据,数据的核心是记忆体。而当你去看 token 经济学(token economics),它必然依赖记忆体。」

"And as the token usage grows with greater context windows, greater key-value caching, and of course larger and larger models, it requires not just compute, but the ability to remember — the ability to have more memory, higher-performance memory as well. So from a demand point of view, this is all still in very, very early innings. We see that AI has long legs here."

「随着 token 用量增长——更大的上下文窗口、更多的键值缓存(key-value caching),当然还有越来越大的模型——需要的不只是算力,还有『记得住』的能力:更多的记忆体、更高性能的记忆体。所以从需求角度看,这一切都还处在非常非常早期的阶段。我们认为 AI 在这里有很长的后劲。」

"The other side is supply, Jodi — that is very important to understand the full dynamics here. On the supply side, as is well known, supply is extremely short versus demand. And this is because high-bandwidth memory, high-performance memory — which is not just high-bandwidth memory, you know, feature products like LP6, DRAM, all of them which are critical parts of data center as well as various edge devices — they all just require a lot of wafers."

「另一面是供给,Jodi——要理解全部的供需动态,这点非常重要。供给侧,众所周知,相对于需求极度短缺。原因在于高带宽内存(HBM)、高性能内存——不只是 HBM,还有像 LP6、DRAM 这些特性产品,它们都是数据中心和各类边缘设备的关键组成——全都需要大量晶圆。」

"Because as they get to higher performance, they are becoming bigger in die sizes, requiring more and more wafers. And all of this needs tremendous greenfield capacity. Construction of those fabs takes a long time. Equipping those fabs, qualifying the lines, bringing up the supply — which comes up in a gradual fashion — takes a long time too. So you really have to look at both the demand side and the supply side, and the fundamentals have just changed for our industry in both of those regards."

「因为性能越往上走,芯片的 die(裸片)尺寸就越大,需要的晶圆也越来越多。而这一切都需要巨量的新建(greenfield)产能。建那些晶圆厂(fab)要花很长时间;给厂装设备、做产线认证、把供给爬升起来——而且供给是逐步释放的——同样很费时间。所以你必须同时看需求侧和供给侧,而我们这个行业的基本面,在这两方面都已经变了。」

"So but once the supply side catches up and there's an equilibrium, usually then it begins to tilt — like there's too much. Do you see that in the next 5 years? Because it seems that if this is a cycle, and we're on the way up right now, the correction could be brutal."

「可是一旦供给侧追上来、达到平衡,通常接着就会开始倾斜——变成供过于求。你觉得未来 5 年会出现这种情况吗?因为看上去,如果这是一轮周期、而我们现在正在上行,那回调可能会非常惨烈。」

"So what I would tell you is, again, that this is early days of AI, and more and more memory is going to be needed as AI, as intelligence, as agentic AI advances. On the other hand, supply is way short of demand. I cannot project when supply catches up with demand. We see supply being tight in the industry well beyond 2026 time frame."

「我要告诉你的是,再说一遍:这是 AI 的早期阶段,随着 AI、智能、agentic AI 的推进,需要的记忆体会越来越多。另一方面,供给远远赶不上需求。我没法预测供给什么时候能追上需求。我们看到行业的供给紧张会一直持续到 2026 年之后很久。」

"And again, you have to just look at the fundamentals. How does supply come up? Supply comes up through greenfield fabs. These fabs, from shovel in the ground to getting first wafers out, takes like 3 years, 4 years kind of time frame. And then you have to ramp up production as well. And that ramp-up of production will always be done in line with the latest demand assessments."

「还是那句话,你只要看基本面。供给是怎么来的?供给靠新建晶圆厂。这些厂从破土动工到产出第一批晶圆,大概要三到四年。之后你还得把产能爬坡上去。而这个爬坡,永远都会跟着最新的需求评估走。」

"And the other thing to point out is that technology is getting more and more difficult. That means each successive generation of technology is giving you less productivity in terms of gigabits gain. All of this combination really bodes for demand and supply fundamentals to stay healthy in the foreseeable future."

「另外要指出的是,技术越来越难做了。这意味着每往后一代技术,带来的每瓦/每片晶圆的 gigabit(容量)增益越来越少。这一切叠加在一起,预示着在可预见的未来,供需基本面会保持健康。」

"When was it that you first realized that AI wasn't going to be one of these typical technology transitions?"

「你是什么时候第一次意识到,AI 不会是那种寻常的技术换代?」

"Certainly for 2022, with ChatGPT — that absolutely changed the world and drove a tremendous inflection point in the demand environment. But even back in 2020, when it was known that AI is starting to build momentum, we had frankly begun to talk about how memory is going to be at the heart of enabling AI."

「2022 年 ChatGPT 出来,那当然彻底改变了世界,在需求环境上拉出了一个巨大的拐点。但其实早在 2020 年前后,当大家意识到 AI 开始积聚势头时,我们就已经在谈,记忆体将如何成为支撑 AI 的核心。」

"And even in '21, Micron was talking about that increases in supply will be needed, because we could see that products like high-bandwidth memory and their planned roadmap needed more and more silicon. And high-bandwidth memory back then was barely less than a single-digit percent of 1% of the memory industry."

「甚至到 2021 年,美光就在讲需要增加供给,因为我们看得到像高带宽内存(HBM)这类产品、按它们规划的路线图,会需要越来越多的硅。而当时 HBM 在整个存储行业里的占比,还不到 1% 的个位数。」

"So we could see that future generations of high-bandwidth memory are going to require a lot of silicon, and high-bandwidth memory had tremendous growth and its impact on the supply dynamic. And that's why we said greenfields have to be built, back even in 2021."

「所以我们看得出,未来几代 HBM 会吃掉大量的硅,HBM 增长会非常猛,会冲击整个供给格局。这就是为什么早在 2021 年我们就说:必须新建晶圆厂(greenfields)。」

"But there is no doubt that nobody projected that AI will take off at this rapid pace of advancement. Whether it is logic silicon or memory silicon, nobody predicted that the need would grow this fast."

「但毫无疑问,没有人预料到 AI 会以这么快的速度起飞。不管是逻辑芯片(logic silicon)还是存储芯片,没人料到需求会涨得这么快。」

"Right. And so when was it — I was in China in October of last year, and that was really the first time that I sort of heard grumblings that there is going to be a major memory shortage. I think it was CXMT was talking about that they were sold out for the next 2 years."

「是。那是什么时候——我去年 10 月在中国,那其实是我第一次隐约听到风声,说要出现一次大的存储短缺。我记得是长鑫(CXMT)在说,他们未来两年的货已经卖光了。」

"It was the first time — a little bit of grumblings before that. When was it for you guys that you said, okay, we're in for a major capacity crunch?"

「那是我第一次听到——在那之前也有些零星的议论。对你们来说,是什么时候你们说『好,我们要面对一次大的产能紧缺了』?」

"I think it was even in our December 2023 earnings call we had talked about that leading-edge memory supply is going to start becoming tighter in 2024, certainly 2025. We saw that memory supply tightness only was growing — and it was growing not just for leading-edge memory, but even some of the long-life-cycle products such as DDR4 memory that go into applications like automotive, industrial, networking. So, across the board."

「我觉得早在我们 2023 年 12 月的财报电话会上,就已经谈到:领先制程的存储供给会从 2024 年、肯定到 2025 年开始变紧。我们看到存储供给的紧张只增不减——而且不只是领先制程的存储在紧,连一些长生命周期产品,比如用在汽车、工业、网络设备里的 DDR4,也在紧。所以是全线。」

"So we began to see some of these trends develop, and we began to speak to it in late '23 and '24 time frame. So, people—"

「所以我们开始看到这些趋势浮现,从 2023 年底到 2024 年就开始对外讲了。所以,人们——」

"Yeah, but — as I said earlier, we began to plan our investments even in '21, '22 time frame. But of course, 2023 was a brutal year for the semiconductor industry, and that's when some of the investments in new capacity were slowed down as well."

「是,不过——我前面说了,我们早在 2021、2022 年就开始规划投资了。但当然,2023 年对半导体行业是残酷的一年,正是那时候,一些新产能的投资也被放缓了。」

"So, we talk a lot in our industry about technology, a lot about innovation, and not so much about the responsibility of the technologies that we're enabling. So, how do you feel about Micron's and Sanjay's responsibility to the world about AI?"

「在我们这行,我们谈很多技术、很多创新,但很少谈我们正在催生的这些技术背后的责任。所以,关于 AI,你怎么看美光、看 Sanjay 你本人对这个世界的责任?」

"And maybe even address — you've heard a bit of a backlash lately about AI. You heard some of these graduation speakers get booed off stage when they mentioned AI in their commencement addresses. So there seems to be some grumblings. How, as a human being, do you worry about AI? Is it something that we should all be concerned about, or is it just something that's going to happen?"

「甚至也许可以回应一下——最近能听到一些对 AI 的反弹。有些毕业典礼的演讲嘉宾,一提到 AI 就被嘘下了台。所以好像有些不满的声音。作为一个人,你对 AI 有担忧吗?它是我们所有人都该警惕的东西,还是说它就是要发生的事?」

"I know that there are obviously concerns regarding jobs getting impacted with AI. But I think the part that we all have to be really excited about and optimistic about is the innovation that AI enables. Many of the problems that have been unsolved forever have an opportunity to get solved, and when innovation happens, that creates tremendous new opportunity as well."

「我知道,大家显然担心 AI 会冲击就业。但我觉得,我们真正应该为之兴奋、为之乐观的,是 AI 所催生的创新。许多一直悬而未决的问题,现在有机会被解决;而创新一旦发生,本身又会创造出巨大的新机会。」

"And then when you also look at demographics, particularly in the developed countries — populations are aging. So the productivity that AI provides, I believe, will absolutely be essential for the GDP growth rates to continue in the developed countries as well."

「再看人口结构,尤其是发达国家——人口在老龄化。所以我相信,AI 带来的生产率,对发达国家维持 GDP 增速绝对是必不可少的。」

"And in terms of our responsibility — we have tremendous responsibility to our customers and of course to the team members at Micron. Over the last several years, we have been absolutely focused on driving a transformation at Micron itself, making Micron a clear technology and product leader in memory and storage."

「至于我们的责任——我们对客户、当然也对美光的团队成员,都负有巨大的责任。过去这几年,我们一直全力推动美光自身的一场转型,让美光成为存储与记忆体领域明确的技术与产品领导者。」

"I'm very pleased that through the hard work of our tens of thousands of team members, Micron has positioned itself today with the most comprehensive technology and product portfolio. So yes, that has been a big responsibility. And again, it's the team that enables it, that makes it happen, and I'm very proud of that team."

「我很欣慰,靠着数万名团队成员的努力,美光今天拥有了最全面的技术与产品组合。所以是的,这一直是一份很重的责任。而再说一次,是团队让它成为可能、让它真正落地,我为这支团队感到非常骄傲。」

"In terms of responsibility to our customers, who are planning on continuing to invest — CapEx reaching trillion dollars in the coming few quarters — that is of course a big responsibility to ensure that we continue to support their advances in AI, because AI means revenue growth opportunities for them. It means innovation opportunities for our customers."

「至于对客户的责任,他们正打算继续加大投入——未来几个季度资本开支(CapEx)将逼近万亿美元——这当然是一份很重的责任:要确保我们持续支撑他们在 AI 上的推进,因为 AI 对他们意味着营收增长的机会,意味着创新的机会。」

"So yes, there's the responsibility to continue to bring advanced technology products and supply that meets the requirements. This is a big responsibility, and all our team is working very hard towards that."

「所以是的,还有一份责任:持续拿出先进的技术产品,提供能满足需求的供给。这是一份很重的责任,我们全队都在为此拼命努力。」

"Yeah, this morning Erin Brockovich was on one of the morning shows talking about that communities aren't getting a say in these data centers that are being put in their communities. And their people are seeing their energy costs go up. You have water issues and problems. So, I'm just wondering if there is going to be this backlash or pushback on AI."

「是啊,今天早上艾琳·布罗克维奇(Erin Brockovich)上了一档晨间节目,说这些建在社区里的数据中心,社区居民却没有发言权;他们眼看着自家能源成本上涨,还有用水方面的问题。所以我就在想,会不会出现对 AI 的反弹或抵制。」(译注:Erin Brockovich 是美国著名环保维权人士,同名电影由茱莉亚·罗伯茨主演。)

"Of course, the societal issues have to always be considered, and it has to provide benefit for the communities and for the broader populations. And I do believe that with advances that will come with AI — many of them that we may not even be able to imagine today — and the opportunities it will eventually create, I think that will be ultimately good for the community."

「当然,社会层面的问题必须始终被纳入考量,它必须为社区、为更广泛的人群带来好处。我确实相信,随着 AI 带来的进步——很多是我们今天甚至想象不到的——以及它最终会创造的机会,这对社区终归是好的。」

"Of course, it does mean that yes, jobs will change, new jobs will get created, some jobs will get eliminated. And that's why it's really, really important to embrace AI and leverage it to realize your own individual highest potential."

「当然,这也确实意味着:工作会改变,新岗位会被创造出来,有些岗位会被淘汰。正因如此,拥抱 AI、善用 AI 去实现你个人的最高潜能,才真的真的很重要。」

"So, as you know, this podcast is called A Bit Personal. So it's the opportunity to tell the personal story behind the public success. I want to talk about who Sanjay Mehrotra is, and I want to go back to your childhood — before Micron or SanDisk or Berkeley or even the US."

「你知道,这档节目叫《A Bit Personal》。所以这是一个机会,去讲讲公众成就背后那个私人的故事。我想聊聊 Sanjay Mehrotra 到底是谁,我想一路回到你的童年——回到美光、SanDisk、伯克利、甚至来美国之前。」

"And help us understand what childhood was like in the Mehrotra family, in your household, and how maybe some of the ways that you were raised impacted who you eventually became."

「帮我们了解一下,梅赫罗特拉(Mehrotra)家的童年是什么样的,你成长的那个家是什么样的,以及你被养育的方式,可能怎样塑造了后来的你。」

"So, came from humble beginnings, came from a middle-class family in India. I grew up in a home that didn't have a television, that didn't have a phone. And I think the first refrigerator we got in our home was maybe just about the time I became a teenager."

「我出身清贫,来自印度的一个中产家庭。我长大的那个家,没有电视,没有电话。我们家第一台冰箱,大概是我快要成为青少年的时候才有的。」

"So, humble beginnings — and I could see my parents always operating under tremendous constraints, but always very much focused on their children, and particularly on education for their children."

「所以是很清贫的起点——我能看到父母一直在巨大的约束下生活,但他们始终把重心放在孩子身上,尤其是孩子的教育。」

"I grew up in a home that very much focused on family — family first, where family values mattered a lot, and where my dad was absolutely a man of tremendous conviction, a force of nature. He believed in his values and he stood for them, no matter how hard things around him got in terms of living those values."

「我成长的那个家非常重视家庭——家庭第一,家庭价值观分量很重;而我父亲绝对是一个有着巨大信念的人,一股自然之力。他笃信自己的价值观,也始终捍卫它们,无论践行这些价值观让他周遭的处境变得多艰难。」

"I lived under a mom that was very calm, very composed. As you can imagine, coming from modest, humble beginnings, our family did go through a lot of ups and downs and financial hardships as well, and both my parents were absolutely focused on the children. So, a home that also very much focused on education. I think education was always a priority for us."

「我母亲则非常平静、非常从容。你可以想见,出身这么清贫,我们家确实经历过很多起落,也有过经济上的困难,而父母两人都全心扑在孩子身上。所以这也是一个极其重视教育的家。我想,教育对我们来说一直是头等大事。」

"So, you talk about the values that he stood for even when it was hard. What were some of those values — where it seemed like it would have been easier to just back away?"

「你说到他即便艰难也要捍卫的价值观。那些价值观具体是什么——那种看上去明明退一步会更轻松的?」

"For him it was very important that equality, for example — men and women getting treated the same. Just keep in mind, I'm talking about the 1960s. We are two brothers and two sisters, and my dad would say in those times that he has four sons, not two sons and two daughters."

「对他来说,平等就非常重要,比如说——男人和女人要被平等对待。你要记住,我说的是 1960 年代。我们家两兄弟、两姐妹,而我父亲在那个年代会说:他有四个儿子,而不是两个儿子加两个女儿。」

"And he sent my sister back in the 60s in India to an engineering college, and the extended family was thinking, what is my dad doing — he's crazy. In those days, there used to be hardly any girls in engineering colleges in India."

「而且早在 60 年代的印度,他就把我姐姐送进了工学院。整个大家族都在想:我爸这是在干嘛——他疯了吧。那年头,印度的工学院里几乎见不到几个女生。」

"So these are the kind of values that my dad absolutely stood for — as well as believing in what is right. Growing up in India, in average society, you could see corruption around you, and he would absolutely never ever take part in it, even if it meant hardship for him. And many times he ran into hardship, but he would never support any act of corruption."

「这些就是我父亲坚决捍卫的价值观——还有,信奉什么是对的。在印度长大,在普通社会里,你能看到周遭的腐败,而他绝对、从来不会去参与,哪怕这意味着他自己要吃亏。很多次他确实因此吃了亏,但他从不会去支持任何腐败行为。」

"That explains a lot about you — how you've always been such a champion of women's rights, of more women participating in our industry. So that tells me a lot, and I'm glad you told me that story. So, how did your parents define success in the household?"

「这就解释了你身上很多东西——你一直是女性权利、是更多女性进入我们这个行业的倡导者。这让我明白了很多,我很高兴你讲了这个故事。那么,你父母在家里是怎么定义『成功』的?」

"Success in the household was definitely making sure that family is together, family is respecting each other and caring for each other, staying connected. Success was that there is respect for elders and respect for the values that were important to the family. And then certainly, success for the children growing up was education."

「家里的成功,首先一定是确保家人在一起,彼此尊重、彼此关心、保持联结。成功也意味着敬重长辈,敬重那些对这个家很重要的价值观。然后,对成长中的孩子来说,成功当然就是教育。」

"And so, all four of you were highly educated. Did you all become engineers?"

「所以你们四个都受了很好的教育。你们都成了工程师吗?」

"Three of us engineers; the fourth was not an engineer early on — she studied dietetics, dietitian courses, but later transitioned to engineering. So, all four of us became engineers and practiced engineering. Yes."

「我们四个里有三个是工程师;第四个一开始不是——她学的是营养学、营养师课程,但后来转去了工程。所以我们四个最后都成了工程师,也都从事了工程工作。是的。」

"Wow, that's pretty amazing. So, were you a very serious kid and a very serious student? I want to hear about some mischief that you must have done."

「哇,这太了不起了。那你是个很严肃的孩子、很认真的学生吗?我倒想听听你肯定干过的一些调皮事。」

"Yeah, generally a very serious student, on the quieter side. But yes, there were times when I did get in trouble for some of the mischief. Particularly in college in India — I did 2 years of college in India before transitioning to Berkeley here to finish my undergrad."

「是,总体上是个很认真的学生,偏安静的那种。但确实,也有过因为一些调皮捣蛋惹麻烦的时候。尤其是在印度上大学的时候——我在印度念了两年大学,之后才转到这边的伯克利完成本科。」

"In the very early years in college in India, if the professor was kind of boring — attendance was important, so you'd give your attendance, but then jump out of the window out of the classroom to spare yourself from the torture of the class. So some of those things, along with friends."

「在印度读大学最初那几年,要是教授讲得有点无聊——出勤很重要,所以你会先把到、点个名,然后从教室窗户翻出去,好让自己免受那堂课的折磨。诸如此类的事,都是跟朋友一起干的。」

"In India, sometimes the whole class would decide that they're going to cut the class — because attendance would be very important. But yes, the teacher would be walking from one side and the whole class would be walking in the other direction. [laughter] So yes, I've had some of those funny, crazy moments."

「在印度,有时候全班会一致决定翘掉这节课——因为出勤非常重要嘛。结果就是,老师从一头走过来,全班从另一头反方向走开。(笑)所以是的,我也有过一些好笑又疯狂的时刻。」

"That's funny. So, tell me a little bit about — besides family members — other people, places, or even events that impacted you and put you on the path to where you are today."

「真有意思。那跟我讲讲——除了家人之外——还有哪些人、哪些地方、甚至哪些事件影响了你,把你推上了今天这条路?」

"So, one of the most important events — and I often have talked about it — is when I had finished my 2 years of college in India. I was 18 years old. And my dad always had the dream to send me to the US for higher education. Didn't quite have the financial means, didn't quite have a plan on how to support it, but he had the dream that he wants to send me to the US."

「最重要的事件之一——这事我常讲——是我在印度读完两年大学的时候。我当时 18 岁。我父亲一直有个梦想,要送我去美国接受高等教育。他没什么钱,也没什么具体计划去支撑这件事,但他就是有这个梦:要送我去美国。」

"Of course, my elder brother, who was already here — I must always be very thankful to him, because he supported my dad's dream and said okay, he will try to support me. And remember, at that time he was only about in his late 20s."

「当然,我哥哥那时已经在美国了——我必须永远感激他,因为他支持了我父亲的梦想,说好,他会尽量供我。要知道,那时候他自己也不过二十七八岁。」

"So, I went to the US Embassy with admissions in hand from US universities, and I got denied my visa three times, three different times. And when that happened, my dad didn't accept it, and he said he wants to talk to the consul on duty — who happened to be out for lunch."

「于是我拿着美国大学的录取通知,去了美国大使馆,结果被拒签了三次,三个不同的时间被拒。这事发生后,我父亲不接受,他说他要跟当值的领事谈——而那位领事刚好出去吃午饭了。」

"As he walked back in, my dad essentially grabbed hold of him — and I must say, he was very kind, and we were lucky that he let us into his office. And at that moment, for about 20 minutes, my dad essentially made a case for me. He was my father, he was my lawyer, he was my coach in that moment."

「等领事一走回来,我父亲基本上就把他拦住了——我得说,那位领事人很好,我们也很幸运,他让我们进了他的办公室。就在那一刻,大约 20 分钟里,我父亲基本上就是在为我据理力争。那一刻,他是我的父亲,是我的律师,是我的教练。」

"He made a very passionate case — 20 minutes of non-stop from my dad: why would the consul deny me the opportunity to come to the US? Don't they realize what a loss it would be for me? But he also said: you would be denying a very strong student in your country at that time."

「他做了一场非常充满激情的陈词——我父亲不停地讲了 20 分钟:领事为什么要剥夺我去美国的机会?他们难道不明白,这对我会是多大的损失?但他同时也说:你这样做,等于在拒绝当时你们国家(指美国)本可拥有的一名非常优秀的学生。」

"And at the end of that 20 minutes, the consul took the passport and he stamped the visa. It was a performance of a lifetime for me to watch — and learn from. And it was at that moment that I learned that if you ever seek success, start with tenacity. My dad just did not give up."

「20 分钟过后,领事拿过护照,盖了签证章。那是我此生看过的一场最精彩的表演——也是我学到东西的一刻。就在那一刻,我学会了:如果你想要成功,先从韧性(tenacity)开始。我父亲就是不放弃。」

"Of course, I also learned, and have always appreciated, that we were very lucky. Suppose that consul had not walked in at that time, and my dad was not able to get hold of him — or if he didn't want to listen to him, he could have easily walked him out. We were just lucky as well. So tenacity and, no question, luck do play an important role."

「当然,我也学到、并且一直心存感激的是:我们非常幸运。假如那位领事当时没走回来,我父亲拦不住他;或者他不愿意听,大可以轻易把他请出去。我们也确实是走运。所以韧性,加上——毫无疑问——运气,都扮演着重要角色。」

"Others that have really influenced me: my professor at Berkeley, who absolutely coached me, guided me back in 1979 when I was looking for jobs and graduating with my master's. He guided me towards Intel, where I joined the team of George Perlegos, who absolutely became a mentor for me."

「还有一些真正影响过我的人:我在伯克利的教授,1979 年我读完硕士、找工作时,他全力辅导我、指点我。他把我引向了英特尔(Intel),我在那里加入了 George Perlegos(乔治·珀勒戈斯)的团队,他后来成了我的导师。」

"He was the golden boy of non-volatile memories at Intel Corporation. He really taught me back then in the early '80s that engineering was not just about design engineering — which is what I had studied for, and I had started as a design engineer first in the industry — but that you had to focus on test and manufacturability, quality, and that this was all the responsibility of the engineers designing the chip."

「他是英特尔非易失性存储领域的『金童』。早在 80 年代初,他就真正教会我:工程不只是设计工程——那是我学的专业,我进这行最初也是做设计工程师——你还必须关注测试、可制造性、质量,而这一切都是设计芯片的工程师的责任。」

"So I learned that discipline very early on from him, and I always thank him for coaching me to become a good engineer. And then Eli Harari, the lead founder at SanDisk, he absolutely helped me transition from an engineering manager, or an engineer, to a business leader."

「所以我很早就从他身上学到了这种纪律,我一直感谢他把我带成了一名好工程师。再后来是 Eli Harari(伊莱·哈拉里),SanDisk 的首席创始人,他实实在在地帮我从一名工程经理、或者说工程师,转型成了一名商业领导者。」

"So these — my dad, my professor at Berkeley, my first boss in the industry George Perlegos (who later became founder of Atmel Corporation as well), and Eli Harari, the lead founder of SanDisk — have absolutely shaped my career."

「所以这些人——我父亲、我伯克利的教授、我进这行的第一任老板 George Perlegos(他后来也成了 Atmel 公司的创始人),还有 SanDisk 的首席创始人 Eli Harari——彻底塑造了我的职业生涯。」

"And I would say that my wife plays a very, very important role in my journey, because where I am today would not have been possible if she had not sacrificed her career to raise our daughters. She was a well-respected accountant as well as controller in the tech industry, but in the late '90s, in order to support the kids, she gave up her career. And that definitely helped me focus on my professional journey as well."

「我还要说,我太太在我这一路上扮演着极其、极其重要的角色,因为如果不是她牺牲了自己的事业来抚养我们的女儿,就不会有今天的我。她在科技行业是一位很受尊敬的会计、也做过财务总监(controller),但在 90 年代末,为了照顾孩子,她放弃了自己的事业。而这无疑也让我能专注于自己的职业之路。」

"Okay. Very good. So it's very interesting in our industry, because there are a lot of leaders of Indian descent. And they all sort of have a few things in common — very ambitious, very driven, very disciplined, very resilient."

「好,很好。在我们这个行业里有件很有意思的事:有很多印度裔的领导者。而且他们似乎都有几个共同点——非常有抱负、非常有干劲、非常自律、非常坚韧。」

"So, do you find that those characteristics are true about the other Indians that you work with in the industry? And do you think those characteristics — and maybe being an outsider when you came to the US — helped you?"

「那么,你身边在这行共事的其他印度人,身上是不是也有这些特质?你觉得这些特质——也许还有你刚来美国时作为一个『外来者』的身份——帮到你了吗?」

"Certainly the background that you come from does shape who you are. It shapes your character, and that absolutely influences your leadership style as well. No question that very many of the Indians here in the tech ecosystem went through a tremendous amount of competition to get into the best schools in India, as well as schools here in the US."

「你的出身背景确实会塑造你是谁。它塑造你的性格,也绝对会影响你的领导风格。毫无疑问,在科技圈里的很多印度人,都经历过极其激烈的竞争,才挤进印度最好的学校,以及之后美国这边的学校。」

"So competition, and thriving in competition, is absolutely deeply rooted — because in India, 1.4 billion people, even at the school level, the high-school level, there's a tremendous amount of competition. But also, India is a developing country, a country of many constraints in terms of resources. Many of us come from humble beginnings, middle-class family backgrounds, just like I described for myself."

「所以竞争、以及在竞争中胜出,绝对是深深扎根的——因为印度有 14 亿人,哪怕在学校层面、中学层面,竞争都极其激烈。但另一方面,印度是个发展中国家,一个资源上处处受限的国家。我们很多人出身清贫、中产家庭背景,就像我刚才描述自己的那样。」

"And that learning of how to operate within constraints, I believe, ends up somehow being ingrained in us — seeing that in our childhood growing up, and managing through all of life, even going to colleges in India. Operating under constraint, when you think about it, that is such an important aspect for running a business."

「而那种『如何在约束下行事』的学习,我相信,最终多少会内化进我们的血液里——从小就看在眼里、在整个人生里去应对,连在印度上大学都是如此。在约束下行事——你仔细想想,这对经营一家企业来说,是何等重要的一种能力。」

"And another part is that India is a very, very diverse country. So you end up growing up within a lot of diversity, so you naturally learn to respect and to hear various points of view, and that ultimately helps as well."

「另一点是,印度是一个非常非常多元的国家。所以你是在大量的多样性中长大的,你自然而然地学会尊重、学会倾听各种不同的观点,这最终也很有帮助。」

"And lastly — think about us as students coming here to the country, giving up what we had in our own upbringing there, and adjusting into a totally new environment. That adaptability that is needed, and that element of risk in just going to a new country. When I came here and went to Berkeley, I didn't know a single person. I didn't even have housing arranged."

「最后——想想我们这些学生来到这个国家,放下了自己在那边成长起来的一切,去适应一个全然陌生的环境。这需要的那种适应力,以及单单是去到一个新国家本身就带着的那份风险。我刚来、去伯克利的时候,一个人都不认识,连住的地方都还没安排好。」

"So how you have to adapt at that point, the element of risk you're taking — you are certainly stretching out of your comfort zone when you're coming to a foreign country and adjusting to a new education system as well as a cultural environment. It just brings about a cultural agility as well."

「那一刻你必须如何去适应、你承担的那份风险——来到一个异国、去适应一套新的教育体系和文化环境,你必然是在把自己拉出舒适区。这也会带来一种文化上的敏捷度(cultural agility)。」

"So all of those attributes, when you think about it, do help in running a business. And when you come here as a foreign student, you are definitely very much focused on gaining stability, establishing yourself. You're absolutely hungry as well. That, again, is something that's always helpful in business too."

「所以这些特质,你想想,确实都对经营企业有帮助。而当你作为一名外国学生来到这里,你必然非常专注于站稳脚跟、立住自己。你也绝对是『饥渴』的。这一点,同样,在生意场上始终是有帮助的。」

"Right. And that makes sense, because it's not only in our industry. If you look at global companies around the world, so many of them were led by those of Indian descent. So it's fascinating."

「是。这说得通,因为不只是我们这个行业。你看全球各地的跨国公司,有那么多是由印度裔在掌舵。所以这真的很引人入胜。」

"This episode is brought to you by Morgan Stanley. Morgan Stanley celebrated its 90th anniversary last year, and its tech investment banking team has prided itself in working with the most innovative entrepreneurs and leadership companies for decades. During that time, they've led IPOs for hundreds of tech companies, including Apple, ARM, Astera Labs, Broadcom, Cisco, Facebook, Google, Nvidia, Salesforce, and Uber."

「本期节目由摩根士丹利(Morgan Stanley)赞助。摩根士丹利去年迎来 90 周年,其科技投行团队几十年来一直以服务最具创新力的创业者和头部企业为傲。这期间,他们主导了数百家科技公司的 IPO,包括苹果、ARM、Astera Labs、博通(Broadcom)、思科、Facebook、谷歌、英伟达、Salesforce 和 Uber。」

"In addition, they worked as a trusted advisor and executed thousands of M&A transactions for some of the most industry-defining deals in technology. Throughout the years, Morgan Stanley's tech investment banking team success has been achieved by dedication, consistency, and a North Star purpose of helping its clients to maximize their opportunities and overcome their challenges. Now, let's get back to the episode."

「此外,他们还作为值得信赖的顾问,完成了数千宗并购交易,其中不乏科技史上最具行业定义意义的几笔大单。多年来,摩根士丹利科技投行团队的成功,靠的是专注、稳定,以及一个『北极星』使命:帮客户把机会最大化、把挑战克服掉。现在,我们回到节目。」

"Did all of your siblings end up in the US?"

「你的兄弟姐妹最后都到美国来了吗?」

"Yes, they did."

「是的,都来了。」

"And did your parents end up in the US?"

「那你父母最后也到美国来了吗?」

"My parents then in the 1980s came to the US as well. Yes."

「我父母也在 1980 年代来了美国。是的。」

"Nice. So, they got to see some of your success."

「真好。所以他们看到了你的一部分成就。」

"At SanDisk, they certainly got to see some of my success. Yeah."

「在 SanDisk 时期,他们确实看到了我的一些成就。是的。」

"Were they proud?"

「他们骄傲吗?」

"Both my parents — my dad, my mom — [were] extremely proud. I know that they would be rooting for me and Micron today, as they would have seen the company enter into the trillion-dollar club."

「我父母两人——我爸、我妈——都极其骄傲。我知道,他们今天也会在为我、为美光加油,因为他们会看到公司迈进了万亿美元俱乐部。」

"And my dad was sometimes so proud that he would embarrass me, talking about me and my siblings to other members, and I would cringe and I would like to leave the room. So, yes."

「我爸有时候骄傲到会让我尴尬——他会跟别人没完没了地讲我和我的兄弟姐妹,我都听得脚趾抠地、只想离开房间。所以,是啊。」

"That's cute. So, it's been so much fun the last few years in our industry because, really starting in 2016, people began to take notice of our industry. By 2020, even everyday people knew about semiconductors, because they couldn't get a car or refrigerator that they wanted. And today we sit at the center of what everybody, every country, emphatically cares about, including national security."

「太可爱了。说起来,过去这几年我们这个行业特别有意思:大约从 2016 年起,人们开始注意到我们这行;到 2020 年,连普通人都知道半导体了,因为他们买不到想要的车、想要的冰箱。而今天,我们坐在了每个人、每个国家都极为在意的事情的正中央,包括国家安全。」

"So, what do you think about this evolution of the recognition of semiconductors, and do you ever worry about governments — whether it's our government or the Indian government or others — getting too involved in our industry?"

「那么,你怎么看半导体被认可的这种演变?你会不会担心政府——不管是美国政府、印度政府还是别的——过度介入我们这个行业?」

"Micron is making investments of $200 billion here in America, bringing leading-edge memory manufacturing as well as long-life-cycle memory manufacturing in the US. Just last Friday, actually, we had the start of our first wafers from an expansion and modernization of our facility in Manassas, Virginia — very much targeted toward long-life-cycle products."

「美光正在美国本土投资 2000 亿美元,把领先制程的存储制造、以及长生命周期的存储制造都放到美国来。其实就在上周五,我们位于弗吉尼亚州马纳萨斯(Manassas)工厂经过扩建和现代化改造后,产出了第一批晶圆——主要面向长生命周期产品。」

"Boise, Idaho, as well as Syracuse, New York — we are making investments to build leading-edge memory fabs here. So, clearly the importance of semiconductors, and certainly the importance of memory, how important it is to AI, is well recognized — not only by the US government, but definitely by governments across the world. And that's a great place for the semiconductor industry to be in."

「在爱达荷州博伊西(Boise)和纽约州雪城(Syracuse),我们也在投资建设领先制程的存储晶圆厂。所以很明显,半导体的重要性、尤其是存储的重要性、它对 AI 有多重要,已经被充分认识到了——不只是美国政府,全世界的政府都明确认识到了这一点。对半导体行业来说,这是一个非常好的位置。」

"And of course, we have tremendous responsibility to ensure that, where we have offices, where we have operations, we are supporting the growth of our teams, the communities, as well as our operations there."

「当然,我们也肩负巨大的责任:确保在我们设有办公室、设有运营的地方,我们都在支持团队的成长、支持当地社区,以及我们在那里的运营。」

"And so, how do you think the US is doing in terms of being competitive worldwide now?"

「那么,你觉得现在美国在全球竞争力方面表现如何?」

"I think the US is doing very well. Certainly when we look at Micron as a memory leader here in the US, and as the only company in the Western Hemisphere that manufactures memory, Micron is doing very well. The US is absolutely leading in innovation, leading with technology."

「我觉得美国做得非常好。当然,看美光作为美国本土的存储领导者、作为西半球唯一一家制造存储的公司,美光做得非常好。美国在创新上绝对领先,在技术上领先。」

"And I think you see that in terms of how AI models are advancing, how inference solutions are advancing. So overall the US is doing very well. Of course, for such an exciting opportunity, there is intense competition from overseas as well — certainly competition from China there as well — but I think the US is well positioned to continue to lead."

「我想,你从 AI 模型怎样在进步、推理方案怎样在进步,就能看到这一点。所以总体而言美国做得非常好。当然,面对这么激动人心的机会,来自海外的竞争也很激烈——其中当然也包括来自中国的竞争——但我认为美国处在一个继续领跑的有利位置。」

"It's been very interesting to watch the semiconductor industry's leadership over the years, because it's not only the people that have changed, but the style of leadership has changed a lot. It used to be a pretty brutal industry in terms of leadership — you think back at the Morris Chang days and at TI. And I'm sure you experienced it probably at the early days of Intel."

「这些年看着半导体行业的领导层变化,很有意思——变的不只是人,领导风格也变了很多。过去这个行业在领导力上挺残酷的——你回想张忠谋(Morris Chang)那个年代、想想德州仪器(TI)。我猜你在英特尔早期大概也经历过。」

"But it seems to be sort of a kinder, gentler leadership today. Do you believe that? And why do you think that has changed?"

「但今天的领导力似乎变得更和善、更温和了。你认同吗?你觉得为什么会有这种改变?」

"Yeah, I think the industry was definitely, in the early years, very much a go-go kind of industry. With technology advancing fast, product innovation happening, applications growing from PCs to mobile phones to cloud — a very go-go kind of industry."

「是,我觉得这个行业在早些年,绝对是那种『一路狂奔』(go-go)的行业。技术飞速演进,产品创新不断,应用从 PC 一路扩张到手机、再到云——非常『狂奔』的一个行业。」

"And I think the industry has generally recognized that it's not only about technology and products and manufacturing and business and revenues and profits, but it is also about culture. And that increased focus on culture in the semiconductor industry definitely has brought about a different kind of leadership transition across the industry too."

「而我觉得整个行业已经普遍认识到:它不只是关于技术、产品、制造、生意、营收和利润,它也关于文化。半导体行业对文化越来越重视,这无疑也在整个行业里带来了一种不一样的领导力转变。」

"Right. You've built an amazing culture at Micron, and obviously very intentionally. So, how would you describe your leadership skills or style?"

「是。你在美光建立了一种了不起的文化,而且显然是非常有意为之。那你会怎么描述自己的领导能力或风格?」

"My leadership style is definitely one that can focus into the details when necessary. Definitely engineering-driven, very much data-driven, but also very much reliant on the team, and extremely focused on moving fast, and customer-focused as well."

「我的领导风格,绝对是那种必要时能钻进细节里的。它非常工程导向、非常数据导向,但同时也非常依赖团队,极度强调快速行动,也以客户为中心。」

"I'll tell you that in the early years of my leadership at SanDisk, one could say I was a micromanager, because I would be extremely into all the details. Some can say even today that I can be a micro-manager when needed."

「我跟你说实话,我在 SanDisk 早期带团队那几年,可以说我是个『微观管理者』(micromanager),因为我会极度地扎进所有细节里。甚至到今天,也有人会说我在必要时仍然能当个微观管理者。」

"I personally believe that in our industry, when technology moves so fast, products move so fast, customers move so fast, competition moves fast, it is important to be able to see the big picture as well as to dive into the details when necessary, to ensure the company is realizing its fullest potential. So I do think that balance is needed, and I'm able to drive that balance."

「我个人相信,在我们这个行业里,当技术变得这么快、产品变得这么快、客户变得这么快、竞争变得这么快,你既要能看到大图景,也要能在必要时扎进细节,才能确保公司释放出它最大的潜能。所以我确实认为需要一种平衡,而我能够把这种平衡推动起来。」

"But in order to drive that balance, you have to be close to engineering, as well as have strong leaders and strong reliance on those leaders. So at the end of the day, it always is about the team. My leadership style is very much reliant on having a strong team working with me."

「但要推动这种平衡,你必须贴近工程,同时也要有一批强悍的领导者、并高度地依赖他们。所以归根结底,一切都关乎团队。我的领导风格,非常依赖于身边有一支强大的团队和我并肩作战。」

"You're sort of quiet and understated. Do you think that's intentional, or is that just part of your personality?"

「你给人的感觉有点安静、内敛。你觉得这是刻意的,还是就是你性格的一部分?」

"I am. That is definitely part of my personality, that I am on the quieter side. And certainly in situations I would intentionally want to listen as well — listen, process, analyze, decide. And I think just listening is extremely important."

「我确实是。那绝对是我性格的一部分,我偏安静。而且在很多场合,我也会刻意地想去听——听、消化、分析、再决定。我觉得单单是『听』这件事,就极其重要。」

"Right. Well, how would you describe the culture at Micron?"

「好。那你会怎么形容美光的文化?」

"Culture at Micron is one where we enable everybody to be able to express their views. We say that we want to hear all ideas and let the best ideas win. We really try to promote that people should be able to speak up, raise their hand when they see that something can be done differently, better, faster, cheaper, or something is not right and there's an opportunity for improvement."

「美光的文化,是一种让每个人都能表达自己观点的文化。我们说,我们想听到所有的想法,让最好的想法胜出。我们真心努力去鼓励:当人们看到某件事可以换种方式做、做得更好、更快、更省,或者哪里不对、有改进空间时,应该敢于开口、举起手来。」

"Micron is absolutely a very tenacious company, and being in the memory industry, especially now 47 years old, definitely required a tremendous amount of tenacity. So tenacity is a very deeply rooted value in the company. It is also a company where people do care about each other — so 'people' is another core value of Micron."

「美光绝对是一家非常坚韧的公司,身处存储行业、尤其是走过 47 年,必然需要极大的韧性。所以韧性(tenacity)是公司里一项扎根很深的价值观。它也是一家人与人之间真心彼此关怀的公司——所以『人』(people)是美光的另一项核心价值。」

"That's how the founders of the company were in the early days in Boise, but even now as it's expanded globally, that caring for people, understanding people, especially working with different cultures, is an important part of Micron culture. And I would say innovation — absolutely deeply rooted in Micron."

「公司创始人早年在博伊西(Boise)就是这样,而即便如今扩张到全球,这种关怀人、理解人、尤其是和不同文化打交道的能力,依然是美光文化的重要部分。我还要说创新——它在美光扎根极深。」

"There used to be dozens of companies in the memory industry. Today, very few. Really in DRAM, there are only three, and in the US, there's only one DRAM company, and that's Micron. That is enabled by Micron's ability to constantly innovate and leverage it to the company's benefit."

「存储行业过去有几十家公司,如今寥寥无几。光说 DRAM,现在全球只剩三家;在美国,只有一家做 DRAM 的公司,就是美光。这背后靠的,是美光持续创新、并把创新转化为公司优势的能力。」

"We have transitioned Micron culture from being a follower or a survivor to today becoming a clear leader — and not just survive, but thrive as well. The team at Micron is very much absolutely winning."

「我们把美光的文化,从一个追随者、一个幸存者,转变成了今天明确的领导者——不只是活下来,而是活得很好。美光的团队,绝对是在赢的。」

"I see Micron is a very progressive company, and that's not easy to say about a company as old as Micron. And being in memory, you sort of think of that as a less fancy kind of technology. I mean, it is now for sure, but—"

「我看美光是一家非常进取的公司,而对一家像美光这么『年长』的公司来说,这话可不容易说出口。而且做存储,你会下意识觉得那是一种没那么『高级炫酷』的技术。当然,现在它绝对是了,但是——」

"I would definitely want to correct that impression, and that is something people often have misunderstood about memory — how hard it is to make memory. The physics, the chemistry, the material science, all of the engineering that goes into designing these memory chips, producing them in large volume, making sure they have the reliability, the quality, the testability."

「我绝对想纠正这个印象,这也正是人们常常误解存储的地方——做存储有多难。那些物理、化学、材料科学,以及设计这些存储芯片、大批量生产、确保它们的可靠性、质量、可测试性,所投入的全部工程。」

"Ramping those into large volumes, and ensuring that every bit out of these trillions of bits in a product is behaving correctly — there's so much physics and science involved in it. It's hard stuff. It's really hard stuff."

「把这些产品爬坡到大规模量产,并确保一个产品里数以万亿计的比特(bit),每一个都表现正确——这里面有太多物理和科学。这是硬骨头,真的是硬骨头。」

"And now it's getting even harder, because it's not just about scaling. It is absolutely about how to deliver that performance that truly enables AI, from data center to edge — to deliver it in those higher capacities, in those various packages that are needed."

「而现在它变得更难了,因为这已经不只是关于『缩小制程』。它彻头彻尾是关于:如何交付出那种真正能支撑 AI 的性能,从数据中心到边缘——以更高的容量、以各种所需的封装形态把它交付出来。」

"So this is what people many times underestimate. Memory is very, very hard stuff, and one should never underestimate how much technology and engineering goes into producing memory. It is no less than any other part of semiconductor industry, and certain aspects I would say are even harder in memory."

「所以这正是人们常常低估的地方。存储是非常非常难的东西,谁都不该低估生产存储要投入多少技术和工程。它一点不亚于半导体行业的任何其他部分,某些环节我甚至会说,在存储里更难。」

"Okay, we now stand corrected."

「好,我们这就受教、改正过来。」

"I appreciate that."

「谢谢你这么说。」

"So, there's a sort of tension these days between providing opportunity and performative inclusion — the tension between the two. As you know, many companies have dismantled their DEI teams internally, stopped any sort of single-sex programs within their companies."

「如今有一种张力,夹在『提供机会』和『表演式包容』(performative inclusion)之间——这两者之间的张力。你也知道,很多公司内部裁撤了 DEI(多元、公平、包容)团队,叫停了公司里各种单一性别的项目。」

"And we've talked for a long time, because you really were a huge proponent of the GSA's Women's Leadership Initiative, in making sure that this industry has the talent that's necessary to get to a trillion-plus in revenues — that if you're ignoring 50% of the population, it's a great place to start."

「我们聊这件事聊了很久,因为你真的是 GSA(全球半导体联盟)女性领导力计划的大力推动者,为的是确保这个行业拥有足够的人才,去做到万亿美元以上的营收——而如果你忽视了 50% 的人口,那本身就是一个绝佳的着手点。」

"So it was never about lowering any standards. It was trying to make this industry attractive to bring people in, and once they're in, to make it a great industry for women. So how do you think we're doing? How do we solve that kind of tension between performative and actual opportunity?"

「所以这从来不是要降低任何标准。它是想让这个行业有吸引力,把人才引进来;人进来之后,再把它打造成一个对女性很友好的行业。那你觉得我们做得怎么样?我们要怎么化解『表演式』与『真实机会』之间的那种张力?」

"I think you said the keywords. It was never ever about compromising on merit. Absolutely, in the semiconductor industry you cannot thrive if your team is not of the highest merit and your focus is not on merit. So that has always been Micron's focus."

「我觉得你说出了关键词。这从来、从来都不是要在『唯才』(merit)上让步。在半导体行业,如果你的团队不是最顶尖的人才、你的重心不在唯才上,你绝对没法繁荣。所以这一直是美光的重心。」

"If you want to drive innovation and the best outcomes for the business, it's important to be able to hear all ideas, let them bubble up, and decide which are the best to pursue. And providing an inclusive environment for all to express their points of view, debate them, and move forward — I think that is just important, and it's a natural part of Micron as well."

「如果你想驱动创新、为业务拿到最好的结果,就必须能听到所有的想法,让它们冒出来,再决定哪些最值得去追。而提供一个包容的环境,让所有人都能表达观点、辩论、然后向前推进——我觉得这就是重要的,这也是美光天然的一部分。」

"And at Micron, the company has 61,000-plus patents. We are an innovation powerhouse, among the very top innovators in the world. Micron has one innovator who has now exceeded Einstein's patents and is among the top five or so innovators, I believe, in the country. So innovation is flourishing at Micron."

「在美光,公司拥有 6.1 万多项专利。我们是一座创新的发动机,跻身全球顶尖创新者之列。美光有一位发明者,如今专利数已经超过了爱因斯坦,我相信他在全美创新者里排在前五左右。所以创新在美光蓬勃生长。」

"Women innovators — we launched a program in women innovation several years ago, and women innovators at Micron, in terms of their numbers, are continuing to increase as well. And because IP is such a competitive advantage — IP and innovation is what provides you differentiation in your technology and products — we put in a lot of work to convey to all team members how important innovation is, how important IP is."

「女性发明者——几年前我们启动了一个女性创新项目,而美光女性发明者的数量也在持续增加。因为知识产权(IP)是如此重要的竞争优势——IP 和创新正是让你在技术和产品上做出差异化的东西——我们下了很大功夫,向所有团队成员传达:创新有多重要、IP 有多重要。」

"And innovation is not just about technology or products, it is absolutely about business processes — how to do things better, differently. And especially now with AI, as we drive AI transformation in the company, there's a lot of opportunity for innovation. It's not about bolting AI on old business processes. Now is the time to reimagine what we are doing and then add AI elements to it."

「而创新不只是关于技术或产品,它绝对也关于业务流程——如何把事情做得更好、做得不一样。尤其现在有了 AI,在我们推动公司 AI 转型的过程中,创新的机会非常多。这不是把 AI『螺栓』式地拧到旧流程上;现在正是重新想象我们在做什么、然后再往里加入 AI 元素的时候。」

"So this is all part of Micron's culture, and this wouldn't happen if we didn't promote a culture of inclusion — everybody being able to speak up and express their point of view and hear what others have to say as well."

「所以这一切都是美光文化的一部分,而如果我们不去倡导一种包容的文化——让每个人都能开口、表达自己的观点、也听听别人怎么说——这一切根本不会发生。」

"What would you say to young women that are on a STEM path at university, top of their class, double E or physics? What would you say to them about joining the semiconductor [industry]?"

「对那些走在 STEM 道路上、在大学里名列前茅、读电子工程(double E)或物理的年轻女性,你会说什么?关于加入半导体行业,你会对她们说什么?」

"I would say come join Micron. This is the best time for the semiconductor industry, and so many exciting opportunities ahead. Come join the workforce, be part of it, be part of the change and transformation that is ahead for our industry."

「我会说:来加入美光吧。这是半导体行业最好的时代,前方有那么多激动人心的机会。来加入这支队伍,成为其中一员,成为我们行业前方那场变革与转型的一部分。」

"And not only say it to those in the semiconductor curriculum at their universities — I would absolutely say that to young students in middle school or high school. I would love to see them get inspired toward STEM. Micron, for the last several years, has been taking what we call our 'chip camp' to communities across the US, particularly where we have operations."

「而且不只是对那些在大学里读半导体专业的人说——我也绝对会对中学、高中的年轻学生说这番话。我特别希望看到他们被 STEM 点燃。过去几年,美光一直在把我们所谓的『芯片夏令营』(chip camp)带进全美各地社区,尤其是我们有运营的地方。」

"Getting our team members to participate, going to middle schools and high schools, taking the basic education about chips, about semiconductors, to these students, making them aware of the power of semiconductors and sparking interest in sciences, interest in STEM. This is really, really important in order to build the workforce of the future right here in this country."

「让我们的团队成员参与进来,走进中学和高中,把关于芯片、关于半导体的基础知识带给这些学生,让他们意识到半导体的力量,点燃他们对科学、对 STEM 的兴趣。要在这个国家本土打造未来的人才队伍,这真的真的非常重要。」

"Our investments of $200 billion are going to add like 90,000 jobs in the ecosystem. So Micron has to take the responsibility to invest in bringing everybody into the semiconductor workforce — not just women, but veterans, people from all kinds of backgrounds — because we need to add. We have a shortage of talent here as well."

「我们 2000 亿美元的投资,会在整个生态里新增大约 9 万个岗位。所以美光必须承担起责任,去投资把所有人都引入半导体的人才队伍——不只是女性,还有退伍军人、各种背景的人——因为我们需要增加人手。我们这边同样面临人才短缺。」

"Right. So, you talked about the investment of $200 billion over the next few years in the US, and you have to make those kinds of decisions. We talked about the feast and famine in the memory industry, and in a time when there was a lot of famine, you had to make those kinds of big decisions. How do you get comfortable with that kind of risk in making those decisions — and do you ever doubt yourself?"

「是。你刚说到未来几年在美国投 2000 亿美元,这种决定得由你来做。我们聊过存储行业的丰年与荒年,而恰恰是在荒年密布的时候,你却要做出这样的大决定。你是怎么让自己对这种风险、对做这种决定感到踏实的——你有没有怀疑过自己?」

"I have been in this industry, in the memory industry, for 45-plus years. I love this industry, have always believed in its potential, have always believed that the best is yet to come, and I'm super excited to be able to work with our customers to advance AI. And it has been clear that this needs investments to be made. But of course, investments are not made blindly. Investments are made with discipline. Investments are made with data."

「我在这个行业、在存储行业,已经干了 45 年多。我热爱这个行业,一直相信它的潜力,一直相信最好的还在后头,我也无比兴奋能和客户一起去推进 AI。而很清楚的是,这需要做出投资。但当然,投资不是盲目去下的。投资要有纪律,投资要靠数据。」

"Understanding the technology, the applications, where they are going, working closely with our customers to understand where they are going and what role Micron plays — all of that ultimately translates into our assessment, along with our customers' assessment, of what the demand projections can look like. Of course it can go wrong; sometimes you can be oversupplied, sometimes undersupplied. And right now, with AI, this demand environment is here to stay."

「理解技术、理解应用、理解它们走向何方,和客户紧密协作去搞清他们要去哪、美光在其中扮演什么角色——所有这些最终都会汇成我们(连同客户)对需求预测的判断。当然它也可能出错;有时会供过于求,有时会供不应求。而眼下,有了 AI,这种需求环境会持续存在。」

"So understanding, working closely with the customer, understanding the applications and the demand trend and the value proposition of memory, shifting the portfolio toward higher-value solutions — and then, with continued success of executing that strategy, you make the investments based on data, and always with discipline regarding those investments. I always emphasize that, because it's a very important part of Micron strategy."

「所以,去理解、去和客户紧密协作,去理解应用、需求趋势和存储的价值主张,把产品组合往更高价值的方案上转——然后,随着这套战略持续执行成功,你就基于数据去做投资,并且对这些投资始终保持纪律。我总是强调这一点,因为它是美光战略里非常重要的一部分。」

"Today, we are investing in building the greenfields, the shells. As these shells get built out, we'll exercise discipline in how we equip them. That discipline means always assessing what the demand projections are, looking at what the technology capabilities are in terms of giving us bit growth, looking at what the product requirements are and how they impact the supply dynamic, assessing all of that, managing the risk appropriately, and managing capex in a highly efficient manner. These are some of the priorities that our entire team very much focuses on."

「今天,我们在投资建设新厂、建『壳』(shells,即先建厂房)。等这些壳建好之后,我们会在『怎么给它们装设备』上保持纪律。这种纪律意味着:始终评估需求预测如何、看技术能力能给我们带来多少容量(bit)增长、看产品需求是什么、它们如何影响供给格局,把这些全都评估清楚,妥善管理风险,并以极高的效率管理资本开支(capex)。这些都是我们全队高度聚焦的优先事项。」

"Okay. You ever have any self-doubt?"

「好。你有过自我怀疑吗?」

"We do not have self-doubt. We absolutely believe in the opportunity for memory. Today, I think it is very, very clear. And what is always important in our business is to be able to adapt and be agile. And Micron has shown that over the years — that yes, we have exercised financial discipline, but we have shown tremendous adaptability and agility as well."

「我们没有自我怀疑。我们绝对相信存储的机会。今天,我觉得这一点非常非常清楚。而在我们这门生意里,永远重要的是能够适应、保持敏捷。这些年美光已经证明了这一点——是的,我们一直保持财务纪律,但我们也展现出了巨大的适应力和敏捷度。」

"The future of technology will be built on the foundation of advanced hardware and AI. For leaders in this space, the pressure to make the right call on everything from R&D to market expansion is immense. KPMG works with leaders who are building this future. They will help you navigate the risks, responsibilities, and the possibilities of transformational technology so you can make clearer, more confident decisions. When your trusted advisor understands the stakes, you can focus on what's next. Learn more at kpmg.com. Let's get back to the episode."

「科技的未来,将建立在先进硬件与 AI 的基础之上。对这个领域的领导者来说,从研发到市场扩张,处处都要做对决定,压力巨大。毕马威(KPMG)与正在构建这一未来的领导者携手合作,帮你驾驭变革性技术中的风险、责任与可能性,让你做出更清晰、更笃定的决策。当你信赖的顾问真正懂得其中利害,你就能专注于下一步。了解更多请访问 kpmg.com。我们回到节目。」

"So, oftentimes when people look at CEOs, they think it's a pretty glamorous job to have — make the big bucks, you get to go to the White House, you fly on private planes, all these things. But really, the life of a CEO is a pretty tough job. It's a huge responsibility and great sacrifices."

「人们看 CEO,常常觉得这是个挺光鲜的活儿——赚大钱、能进白宫、坐私人飞机,种种这些。但其实,CEO 的生活是一份相当辛苦的工作,责任巨大,牺牲也很大。」

"So, I want to ask you if you've ever had to make sacrifices — as a human being — for your job, that you regret making."

「所以我想问你:你有没有为了工作,作为一个人,做过哪些让你后悔的牺牲?」

"I do not regret making sacrifices, but I definitely had to make them — and the sacrifices were around time. Sacrifices in terms of giving time to family, to parents, to extended family."

「我不后悔做过的牺牲,但我确实必须做出牺牲——而这些牺牲都是关于时间的。给家人、给父母、给大家族的时间上的牺牲。」

"Those sacrifices over the career have certainly been made, because throughout my career journey it has been extremely demanding to be at the bleeding edge of memory technology. The job has involved a tremendous amount of travel as well, given that it's always been a very global company."

「这些牺牲在我的职业生涯里确实都做过,因为一路走来,站在存储技术的最前沿,要求极高。这份工作还涉及大量出差,毕竟它一直是一家非常全球化的公司。」

"So those are the only sacrifices — of time towards loved ones — that I absolutely sometimes wish I had given some more time, for example, to my parents."

「所以唯一的牺牲就是这些——给所爱之人的时间。我有时候确实会希望,自己当初能多给一些时间,比如,给我的父母。」

"Right. So, you've been married for 42 years, and I met your wife earlier. Tell us a little bit about that. First of all, it started out as an arranged marriage, so maybe address that, because a lot of people don't necessarily understand the dynamics behind it."

「是。你结婚 42 年了,我刚才也见到了你太太。跟我们讲讲这段。首先,这一开始是一桩包办婚姻(arranged marriage),也许你可以聊聊,因为很多人未必理解它背后的运作逻辑。」

"And then how you've done it — great sacrifices probably made on both sides. But there are a lot of young people out there who are very reluctant to start families, or think, 'How can I have this amazing, exciting career and have a happy home life?' Is it possible?"

「以及你们是怎么走过来的——大概双方都做了很大的牺牲。但外面有很多年轻人很抗拒成家,或者会想:『我怎么可能既有一份这么精彩、这么刺激的事业,又有一个幸福的家庭生活?』这可能吗?」

"And again, certainly a lot of sacrifices here with respect to the time spent with loved ones — that certainly includes my family, my wife, as well as my children. Very, very fortunate to have an amazing wife, who has an amazingly calm demeanor, is able to go through the ups and downs in a very balanced manner, and remains a rational thinker."

「还是那句话,这里面在陪伴所爱之人的时间上,确实有很多牺牲——这当然包括我的家庭、我太太,还有我的孩子。我非常、非常幸运,有一位了不起的太太,她有着惊人的平静气质,能以非常平衡的方式走过起起落落,始终是个理性的思考者。」

"And yes, we were introduced by our parents and we got married 42 years ago. And yes, arranged marriage — it has absolutely worked wonderfully well for us. Arranged marriage, of course, requires commitment, and of course requires adjustment."

「是的,我们是由双方父母介绍认识的,42 年前结的婚。是的,包办婚姻——对我们来说,它运作得好极了。包办婚姻当然需要承诺,也当然需要彼此磨合调整。」

"And I think both of us — and I would say my wife certainly — have managed that extremely well, and I have had to make adjustments and absolutely a commitment as well. So, very fortunate and feel very blessed to have this successful marriage, which has absolutely been a key contributor to my career journey."

「我觉得我们俩——尤其是我太太——都把这件事处理得极好,我自己也必须去调整、也绝对付出了承诺。所以我很幸运,也深感有福,能拥有这段成功的婚姻,它无疑是我职业之路的一大功臣。」

"Okay, so you ended up making a career sacrifice when you were first married, because she couldn't get into the US, and you actually took a different direction in your career than you thought — and somehow Floyd Kvamme plays into this. I was friends with Floyd Kvamme; we served on the Empower America board together once upon a time. So, tell me that story."

「好,所以你们新婚时,你其实做了一次职业上的牺牲,因为她进不了美国,你的职业方向也因此和原本设想的不同——而 Floyd Kvamme(弗洛伊德·克瓦梅)不知怎么也牵涉其中。我和 Floyd Kvamme 是朋友,我们曾经一起在 Empower America 的董事会任职。所以,跟我讲讲那个故事。」

"Yeah, we got married in 1984, and it would have taken my wife about a year to a year and a half to get her green card to be able to come to the US. So during that time she did not have the visa to come. And Floyd Kvamme was the chairman of the startup company called Seeq Technology that I was with, which was a spin-off from Intel."

「是的,我们 1984 年结婚,而我太太大概要花一年到一年半才能拿到绿卡来美国。所以那段时间她没有签证过来。Floyd Kvamme 当时是我所在的一家创业公司 Seeq Technology 的董事长,那家公司是从英特尔分拆出来的。」

"Intel was the first company I joined in 1980, and then around '82 there was this spin-off called Seeq that I had joined. And a few years later, in that 1984 time frame, I was going to be leaving to join a startup which eventually became Atmel — and I would have been a co-founder at Atmel."

「英特尔是我 1980 年加入的第一家公司,然后大约在 1982 年,有了这家叫 Seeq 的分拆公司,我去了那里。又过了几年,到 1984 年前后,我本打算离开、去加入一家创业公司——它后来成了 Atmel(爱特梅尔)——我本来会是 Atmel 的联合创始人。」

"And Floyd Kvamme took me out to lunch. As the chair, he was basically working on talking me out of leaving and talking me out of starting that company, Atmel. Ultimately, I did not join Atmel, did not start it. But Floyd Kvamme figured out that my wife was at the time in India, and he said he can arrange for me, with the company, to go work in Europe and have my wife be able to come to Europe to join me there."

「于是 Floyd Kvamme 请我吃午饭。作为董事长,他基本上是在劝我别离开、别去创办 Atmel 那家公司。最后,我没有加入 Atmel,也没去创办它。但 Floyd Kvamme 弄清楚了我太太当时人在印度,他说他可以安排,让我通过公司去欧洲工作,这样我太太就能来欧洲和我团聚。」

"And I pounced on that opportunity, because the two of us could spend the early times of our married life together, rather than me being here in the US and she being in India while waiting for her green card. So we chose to go to London, she was able to get her permit to come to London, and I worked as European Applications Engineering Manager for about a year."

「我一把抓住了这个机会,因为我们俩可以一起度过新婚最初的时光,而不是我在美国、她在印度干等绿卡。于是我们选择去了伦敦,她拿到了去伦敦的许可,而我在那边做了大约一年的欧洲应用工程经理(European Applications Engineering Manager)。」

"And I really thank Floyd Kvamme, because going from an engineer — which I was at the time — to a responsibility for applications engineering, where the chips that I had designed, I was seeing the kind of challenges my customers were facing in their own applications. I learned a lot about the customer side, the application side, in that one-year period, and it truly made me realize how important the customer is."

「我真的很感谢 Floyd Kvamme,因为从一名工程师——我当时就是工程师——转到负责应用工程,我亲眼看到自己设计的那些芯片,在客户自己的应用里会遇到什么样的挑战。在那一年里,我对客户侧、应用侧学到了很多,它真正让我意识到客户有多重要。」

"You cannot develop technology or products in a void. You have to work closely with customers. So that one-year experience when we were newly married, thanks to Floyd Kvamme, was an amazing experience of us being together in the first year of our marriage in Europe — but it was also an amazing experience for me in appreciating the value of customer focus, which we today call one of our core values at Micron as well."

「你没法在真空里开发技术或产品,你必须和客户紧密协作。所以新婚那一年的经历——多亏了 Floyd Kvamme——既是我们在欧洲共度婚姻第一年的美好时光,也是我个人体会『以客户为中心』价值的一段宝贵经历,而这正是我们今天在美光所说的核心价值观之一。」

"And what is the one or two things that she's taught you about partnership that you see bleeding over into your work life?"

「那她在『伴侣关系』上教给你的一两件事是什么——你看到它们也渗进了你的工作生活里?」

"In terms of partnership, she definitely taught me that sometimes, before rushing into saying something, just think a little — even if it's a few seconds — before you say it, because otherwise you can say something that you just regret. That's something she has definitely taught me: to think before you blurt out a response. That has been extremely helpful, particularly in certain challenging situations."

「在伴侣关系上,她明确教会我:有时候在急着开口之前,先想一下——哪怕只是几秒钟——再说出口,因为否则你可能会说出让自己后悔的话。这绝对是她教给我的:在脱口而出回应之前,先想一想。这一点极其有用,尤其是在某些棘手的场合。」

"Also I'll share with you a funny story. One of the first interviews that I ever did was at CNBC way back — sometime in the 2000s, I can't remember the exact year. It was Squawk on the Box. And that interview occurred very early in the morning, like maybe 5:00 a.m. Pacific Time. First interview, so obviously nervous on national TV."

「我再跟你分享一个好笑的故事。我这辈子最早做的几次采访之一,是很久以前在 CNBC——大概是 2000 年代某个时候,具体哪一年我记不清了。是《Squawk Box》那档节目。那次采访是在清晨很早的时候,大概太平洋时间早上五点。第一次采访,在全国性电视上,自然很紧张。」(节目名应为 CNBC《Squawk Box》。)

"And she of course was watching from home, my first ever CNBC interview. I come back home, and she has a blanket over her head, and she just quietly says, 'You have a very nice smile, use it more often.' And that has just stayed with me."

「她当然在家看着,看我人生第一次上 CNBC。我回到家,她裹着一条毯子,只是轻轻地说:『你笑起来很好看,多笑笑。』这句话就这样一直留在了我心里。」

"Because obviously in that interview I was tense, I was not smiling. And that has stayed with me in every situation — sometimes in meetings, or particularly in public speaking situations — that importance of being at ease, and smiling, how important that is, what it communicates to the audience and how it helps you build that rapport. So yes, she has been a tremendous coach for me."

「因为很显然,那次采访里我很紧绷,没有笑。这句话从此在每个场合都伴着我——有时在会议上,尤其在公开演讲的场合——那种放松的重要性、微笑的重要性:它向听众传递了什么,又如何帮你建立起那种融洽。所以是的,她一直是我极好的教练。」

"And you do have a great smile. So, you also raised two daughters who became engineers, so bravo on that. Tell me how they view your success in your career."

「你的笑容确实很好。你还养大了两个女儿,她们都成了工程师,这点真棒。跟我说说,她们怎么看你事业上的成功?」

"For the longest time, they had not realized that their dad was an important executive in the technology industry — which is all good, because our focus was always raising our family, being in the family, and keeping work really separate from family interactions."

「在很长一段时间里,她们都没意识到自己的爸爸是科技行业里一位重要的高管——这其实挺好的,因为我们的重心一直是养育这个家、待在家庭里,把工作和家庭里的相处真正分开。」

"Even though I was traveling a lot, I would absolutely try my best to even sometimes call my kids on the phone if they needed some help with homework. I remember my older daughter, she was in high school — or maybe eighth grade — and needed some help with linear algebra, and I was on the phone with her trying to work out the problem."

「尽管我出差很多,我也绝对尽最大努力——有时候孩子作业需要帮忙,我会打电话过去。我记得我大女儿读高中、或者也许是八年级的时候,需要点线性代数的帮助,我就在电话里陪她一起把那道题解出来。」

"So even when I'm traveling, I have tried to absolutely stay as close to the family, always through daily calls and conversations with the kids. As far as my two daughters go, extremely proud of them. They've grown up with tremendous values, which I absolutely credit my wife for giving them — the core values, which I'm very proud of. They have pursued their passions, but yes, they both ended up becoming engineers. And they're both in product management in the tech industry today."

「所以哪怕在出差,我也努力让自己尽量贴近这个家,始终靠每天的电话和与孩子的交谈。说到我两个女儿,我为她们感到无比骄傲。她们带着极好的价值观长大,这一点我绝对要归功于我太太——是她给了她们那些核心价值观,我为此非常骄傲。她们追随了自己的热爱,但确实,两人最后都成了工程师。如今她们都在科技行业做产品管理(product management)。」

"So, did you play the same sort of poetic role that your father played in your life — do you think you played that in their life?"

「那你有没有在女儿的生命里,扮演你父亲在你生命里扮演的那种富有诗意的角色?你觉得你扮演了吗?」

"Definitely very much focused on education as well, and absolutely made sure that both my daughters understood that education was important — shared with them how education helped my own career, and that for us to be where we are, education absolutely was key. So yes, just like my parents emphasized education, I definitely emphasized education to my kids."

「我同样非常看重教育,也绝对让我两个女儿都明白教育的重要——我跟她们讲过,教育如何帮助了我自己的事业,我们能走到今天,教育绝对是关键。所以是的,就像我父母强调教育一样,我也一定向孩子强调教育。」

"Perhaps one difference would be that, particularly with the kids growing up here in the US, you have to recognize that it's not just about academics. It is also about extracurriculars, and our kids definitely pursued their passions in areas outside of academics as well, and they still do to this day. In that regard, somewhat different than my own upbringing. And I let them choose their own careers."

「也许一个不同之处在于,尤其是孩子在美国长大,你得认识到:重要的不只是学业,还有课外活动。我们的孩子也确实在学业之外的领域追求自己的热爱,到今天依然如此。在这一点上,和我自己的成长经历有些不同。而且我让她们自己选择职业道路。」

"My older daughter, when she went to college, thought she was going to be pre-med, but very quickly in the first year or two she gravitated toward engineering. My younger daughter thought she was going to be more toward public policy, but very quickly she too gravitated toward engineering when in college."

「我大女儿上大学时,本以为自己要走医学预科(pre-med),但很快在头一两年就转向了工程。我小女儿本以为自己会更偏向公共政策,但她在大学里也很快同样地转向了工程。」

"Okay. Very nice. So, I'm going to end on a question and just ask you: what would people miss about who you are as a person if they just looked at your résumé?"

「好,真好。那我用一个问题来收尾,就问你:如果人们只看你的简历,他们会错过你作为一个人的哪些部分?」

"Couple of things. One very funny thing: one time I met a CEO in the semiconductor industry — who's still a CEO in the industry. When I met him for the first time, he said to me, 'Boy, I had an image of a very tall person.' It's just funny that, looking at my background, my résumé, he was expecting a tall person. So people wouldn't see in my résumé that I'm actually short. That's just a funny side of it."

「有几件事。一件很好笑:有一次我见到半导体行业的一位 CEO——他现在还是 CEO。我第一次见他时,他对我说:『哎呀,我本来以为你会是个很高的人。』有意思的是,光看我的背景、我的简历,他以为会见到一个高个子。所以人们从我简历里看不出来,我其实个子不高。这是好笑的一面。」

"But also, I don't think if they looked at my résumé, they would know how much I love my family. My kids, my daughters, mean the world to me. I'm very proud of them. And my wife has been absolutely the rock in my life. And now the grandkids."

「但还有,我觉得如果只看我的简历,人们不会知道我有多爱我的家人。我的孩子、我的女儿,就是我的全世界。我为她们无比骄傲。而我太太,绝对是我生命里的磐石。现在,还有孙辈。」

"Yes. Two? And one on the way?"

「是的。两个?还有一个在路上?」

"[Two] granddaughters, and a third granddaughter on the way. And the two granddaughters are 3 years old and 3 months old."

「两个孙女,第三个孙女也快出生了。两个孙女一个三岁,一个三个月大。」

"And on the two different coasts. But they bring out the kid in me. When I'm with the 3-year-old, I play like a little kid, and she absolutely thinks that — whether it's going on the slides, or the swing, or getting inside a little tent to read a book to her — she absolutely thinks that I am a three-year-old too. And this is something people would not realize when they look at my résumé."

「而且分别在东西两岸。但她们能把我心里那个孩子勾出来。我和那个三岁的孩子在一起时,我会像个小孩一样玩,她真的以为——不管是去滑滑梯、荡秋千,还是钻进小帐篷里给她读书——她真的以为我也是个三岁小孩。这就是人们看我简历时不会知道的一面。」

"Right. Well, I'm glad I got to know you a little better, and I'm sure that our audience is going to be thrilled to know the personal story behind your success. So, thank you, Sanjay."

「是。我很高兴能更了解你一些,我也相信我们的听众会很欣喜地听到你成功背后那个私人的故事。所以,谢谢你,Sanjay。」

"Jodi, I really enjoyed this, and thank you for covering so many topics and taking me back to my childhood years, as well as discussing some of the most important aspects of our industry. Thank you for what you have been doing for the semiconductor industry for decades now. I've known you and really appreciated how you bring this industry together in some very important dialogues. Thank you."

「Jodi,我真的很享受这次对话,谢谢你聊了这么多话题,把我带回童年,也谈了我们行业里一些最重要的方面。谢谢你几十年来为半导体行业所做的一切。我认识你很久了,也真心感激你把这个行业凝聚到一起、推动了一些非常重要的对话。谢谢。」

"Thank you. Appreciate it. [music]"

「谢谢你。非常感谢。(音乐)」